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I love this site but be careful. Just a head's up.

Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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1,854
I have run across a few articles about how some would like to shut this site down. I've found so much comfort here after never having a welcoming place to talk about this taboo subject.

So with that in mind I want to let people know there are laws in some places that forbid any form of helping encouraging or assisting suicide.
That includes even if you don't know the person. So be careful of how much information you give out. It's probably best not to give out specific information on methods although the laws vary from place to place on this. Know the laws in your area. Be careful of what you talk about.
This is serious.

The UK for example has some very strict sounding laws about what could be considered helping or assisting suicide. I'm not sure how these are enforced and I'm not a legal expert but just do not be naive about this.

Also be careful when or if you discuss anything illegal such as drugs. It would be pretty easy to set up a sting operation it seems to me. You don't know who you are really talking to here.
 
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nigelhernandez

nigelhernandez

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Can I ask where you have found these articles?
 
Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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On the internet while looking around at other things. When you read about suicides it sometimes mentions they found out about how to do it on sites like this one.
 
Sprite_Geist

Sprite_Geist

?
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What they do not seem to understand is that people join this forum, because it is the only place where a person can talk about their problems without being judged or berated. If this community gets shut down it will likely make the people in it even more suicidal. If they wish for suicidal individuals to "get help" then they should focus on creating an environment where someone, anyone can really open up and express how they feel. Secondly: they should address the reasons for why someone may want to end their lives in the first place.
 
mediocre

mediocre

trapped here
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What they do not seem to understand is that people join this forum, because it is the only place where a person can talk about their problems without being judged or berated. If this community gets shut down it will likely make the people in it even more suicidal. If they wish for suicidal individuals to "get help" then they should focus on creating an environment where someone, anyone can really open up and express how they feel. Secondly: they should address the reasons for why someone may want to end their lives in the first place.
They really don’t care. It’s odd how everybody believes in free speech except when it is about suicide or another topic that is considered taboo. It’s partly because they don’t want to have to think about their own mortality either.
 
Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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Hopefully people are becoming more enlightened about this subject. I wish there were ballot initiatives that allow people to vote on this in every state in the country but you know, pro lifers are, well, very adamant no one should control their own bodies.
 
User Does Not Exist

User Does Not Exist

Buffering.....
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There's been dozens of these stories floating around for as long as I have been here (well over a year!) I don't think main admin are too worried, freedom of speech, also this place isn't pro suicide its pro choice, hence the recovery forum, that alone stands it above a couple others that actively encourage suicide
 
mediocre

mediocre

trapped here
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I kinda of feel people are going backward on the topic rather than forward. I don’t think we are becoming more enlightened or have any more sympathy for those who are mentally or physically ill. At least in the U.K. I don’t see assisted suicide ever becoming legal.
 
T

TheQ22

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They really don’t care. It’s odd how everybody believes in free speech except when it is about suicide or another topic that is considered taboo. It’s partly because they don’t want to have to think about their own mortality either.
No they don't care, they'll be feigning shock and horror as the suicide rates go up through the roof over the next few months as people lose their jobs, homes, possessions and sanity.
 
RoseyBird

RoseyBird

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I‘ve seen that stuff google as well. You’d think these people have bigger fish to fry since actual crime happens in the world. They’re never going to stop, but the site and us are protected under free speech. Hell, most of the time I’m telling people why not to use a chosen method.
 
Soul

Soul

gate gate paragate parasamgate bodhi svaha
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Regarding the OP: The laws that apply in case someone does themself harm are the laws where that person lives, not the laws where I live.

We always need to be careful how we phrase things.
 
Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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Regarding the OP: The laws that apply in case someone does themself harm are the laws where that person lives, not the laws where I live.

We always need to be careful how we phrase things.
How do we know where someone lives?
 
Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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You don’t, but none of us say “hey go kill yourself here is how I want to see you die”
No but as I read the UK law on this it sounded as if simply describing a method in a manner that would be explaining it to someone who was suicidal would be enough.
I like to be cautious. So it's up to each of us how we want to handle this. I just thought I would post this in case there are others like me who are paranoid about this.
 
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RoseyBird

RoseyBird

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No but as I read the UK law on this it sounded as if simply describing a method in a manner that would be explaining it to someone who was suicidal would be enough.
Can you link the source you found? It would be interesting to see the legal wording.
 
BipolarGuy

BipolarGuy

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It isn't just a legal issue, it's an ethical issue.
People should not be anywhere near the line of encouraging somebody to end their life.

We should be supporting people to overcome issues too and to find solutions to their woes.
 
Brick In The Wall

Brick In The Wall

2M Or Not 2B.
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They're arresting people for not wearing masks nowadays. Welcome to the dystopian "new normal" where anything and everything can be made illegal.

I'm going to protect myself but I'm not going to live in fear. Give me liberty or give me death.
 
Meditation guide

Meditation guide

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They're arresting people for not wearing masks nowadays
How I wish they would do that here! Maybe our numbers of deaths would go down instead of up as they do all the time. Maybe some day I would be able to leave my house and go out and do something like go to the dentist, or eye doctor, or bank without fear of catching a horrible disease and dying a horrible death on a ventilator. I'm high risk for it. We are the highest number of deaths in the world now in the US. Please for the love of GOD make everyone wear a mask.
 
RoseyBird

RoseyBird

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It isn't just a legal issue, it's an ethical issue.
People should not be anywhere near the line of encouraging somebody to end their life.

We should be supporting people to overcome issues too and to find solutions to their woes.
Encouraging can be a loose term. Giving someone a recipe may encourage them to cook since they may not even ever tried if they didn’t know how. When people want to screw you over they find a way. That said I’m still going with there’s bigger fish to fry than sad people helping sad people.
 
almost_dead

almost_dead

Master
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Aug 7, 2020
Messages
476
I have run across a few articles about how some would like to shut this site down. I've found so much comfort here after never having a welcoming place to talk about this taboo subject.

So with that in mind I want to let people know there are laws in some places that forbid any form of helping encouraging or assisting suicide.
That includes even if you don't know the person. So be careful of how much information you give out. It's probably best not to give out specific information on methods although the laws vary from place to place on this. Know the laws in your area. Be careful of what you talk about.
This is serious.

The UK for example has some very strict sounding laws about what could be considered helping or assisting suicide. I'm not sure how these are enforced and I'm not a legal expert but just do not be naive about this.

Also be careful when or if you discuss anything illegal such as drugs. It would be pretty easy to set up a sting operation it seems to me. You don't know who you are really talking to here.
*evil laugh*
 
W

worried_to_death

.
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Messages
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If you say "I wish you the best/safe trip" on someone's ctb goodbye thread, is there any law anywhere where that could be considered as encouraging suicide?

I am just unsure now about what it is safe or not safe to say here.
as I read the UK law on this it sounded as if simply describing a method in a manner that would be explaining it to someone who was suicidal would be enough
Really? Is there a specific part of a statute that you read which indicates this?

So simply giving neutral information without incitement or exhortation can be interpreted as encouragement?
Pretty orwellian.
 
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S

Spitfire

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Apr 26, 2020
Messages
435
For those of us in the USA;

(Copy & pasted)
The Minnesota Supreme Court ruled that a law banning 'encouraging' or 'advising' suicide violates the free-speech rights. The court reversed the conviction of a former nurse accused of encouraging two people whom he met online to kill themselves.

The court ruled that the language in the state's assisted-suicide law that pertains to "encouraging" suicide is unconstitutional. It violates the right to free speech. However, the court upheld the part of the law that bans "assisting" suicide.
(End copy & paste)

Encouraging even seems to be allowed, but we still can not yet assist though...
 
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B

Burzolog

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1,106
It isn't just a legal issue, it's an ethical issue.
People should not be anywhere near the line of encouraging somebody to end their life.

We should be supporting people to overcome issues too and to find solutions to their woes.
It makes sense to me as a legal issue. You can figure out if encouraging suicide is allowed, what classifies as encouragement, what is the punishment from breaking the rules etc., but why do you think it's an ethical issue? Are there any defined rules that we would agree upon? Who defines/is going to define the rules? What will serve as the warrant for these rules, or in other words, who is going to enforce the rules onto those who don't wish to abide them?
Give me liberty or give me death.
I like how it's not clear if the "or" is exclusive.
 
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W

worried_to_death

.
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Messages
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why do you think it's an ethical issue? Are there any defined rules that we would agree upon? Who defines/is going to define the rules
I agree with bipolarguy that it's an ethical issue, but I don't think that means there has to therefore be a universally agreed-upon set of moral rules around ctb.
Ethics isn't necessarily about imposing a set of collectively-decided-upon rules on people, but also about thinking through moral dilemmas and problems philosophically.
According to many normative ethical systems, encouraging someone to ctb could be considered morally problematic at the very least.
I also think there's a difference between encouraging and helping. Encouraging is much more morally problematic and a bit of a fuzzy term, and can come down to how someone interprets a specific set of words put together in a certain way.
In some circumstances though, helping someone to ctb can be morally justified from a utilitarian, individualist or moral particularist perspective.
 
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